<P>Kent, and all other STA readers, before the following on this subject falls, I urge all to read the thread by Summer Solsite on Wednesday 8 Dec 2004. Regarding A small boy called Boris. With out hesitation he has answered most of the questions raised in this thread. Just a thought…..<BR>

<P>look around this forum string:<BR><A HREF="http://www.surfingtheapocalypse.net/cgi-bin/forum.cgi?read=39453" TARGET="_blank">http://www.surfingtheapocalypse.net/cgi-bin/forum.cgi?read=39453</A><P>Kent<BR>

<P>I agree.<P>I'm having trouble with the scale & perspective. Is this a close to the ground small crater from one of the rovers or an aerial shot from the orbiter? Either way, look at the shadows of the shadow-casting parts of the orbiter/rover/whatever it is. Why does the tall metal piece not cast a shadow in the same direction as the other parts? Also, the shadows cast on Mars proper, from the rectangular object & some of the larger formations do not match the direction of the sunlight on the rover/orbiter. Any thoughts?<P>

<P>Also:<BR>1 - near the horizon and almost directly above the debris, there's something that appears WAY too bright.<BR>2 - judging from what appears to be the rover's track, it must have gone right by the debris. Are there any close-up pictures?<P>

<P>: Anyone make out what that bright object to the upper left is?<BR>: <A HREF="http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/press/opportunity/20040524a/site_B115_navcam_180_cyl_L-B118R1_br2.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/press/opportunity/20040524a/site_B115_navcam_180_cyl_L-B118R1_br2.jpg</A><P>

<P>Kent, thanks for posting... Check this one out, what is in the upper right had corner... looks like a building with solar panels on it. Ok, what the heck is going on???? I can't belive that NASA would post these without a explanation of some sort, or that the media has not picked up on these!! They are posted under Press Photo's.<P><A HREF="http://origin.mars5.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/press/opportunity/20040524a/site_B115_navcam_180_cyp_R-B118R1_br2.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://origin.mars5.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/press/opportunity/20040524a/site_B115_navcam_180_cyp_R-B118R1_br2.jpg</A><P><div class="centerlink" style="text-align:center"><a href="http://origin.mars5.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/press/opportunity/20040524a/site_B115_navcam_180_cyp_R-B118R1_br2.jpg">NASA PRESS PHOTOS OPPORTUNITY</a></div>

<P>Kent, judging from the tracks, the rover first drove over it then stopped and took a reverse angle shot of it. I don't recall the actual size of the rover and, therefore, the width of the wheel base. Have you been able to ascertain the scale of this artifact? It definitely looks to be wood rather than stone and looks a lot like an old railroad tie (which would be much too big, I'm sure) or, say... a rotting timber from a shipwreck? Crikey! It's Noah's ark!! So THAT'S where it ended up! ;o)<P>

<P>My favoite is still the domes. Like the one shown below from Dangerzone Productions.<P><A HREF="http://palermoproject.com/lowell2004/grandcentral.htm" TARGET="_blank">http://palermoproject.com/lowell2004/grandcentral.htm</A><P><A HREF="http://www.data4science.net/mars/buildings.html" TARGET="_blank">http://www.data4science.net/mars/buildings.html</A><P>More interesting reading and pictures here too:<BR><a href="http://www.marsanomalyresearch.com/evidence-reports/2001/020/giantplants.htm">Mars Anomaly Research</a><P>One caution I do offer is due to the following. It has been shown most conclusively that NASA and JPL are controlling what information is publicly released. The result has been heavily censored pictures and data. Therefore a well-planned agenda is in force, and we are left to speculate and banter on the reasons and ramifications. For instance, this could all be a distracting cover show while other allegedly "lost" probes and "failed" missions are generating the important info and work.<P>My point is that any real "startling" evidence of civilization will be a genuine mistake or slip-up. Everyone makes mistakes, and the current photo editing has been so obvious to true experts that whole websites are devoted to evidence (<a href="http://www.xenotechresearch.com/NASAHACK.htm">here's one</a>). Behind the scenes some major cursing, strategy sessions, and CYA. We either hear silence or delayed explanations. "Rime ice" was one lame theory given for a dome picture.<P>So don't expect more than a tiny handful of definitive pictures of civilization on Mars (or the Moon). However, just a few undeniable images of artificial life does mean there're a large number being witheld. Cool huh?<P>Plus Ultra,<BR>RogueOne<P><div class="centerlink" style="text-align:center"><a href="http://palermoproject.com/lowell2004/domecraters.jpg">Domes on Mars</a></div>

<P>By furtherstudying and moving around the picture on the link, the blocks seem to be part of the Rover, But it still does not explain the "sleeper" shaped rock or the shiny silver thing in the distance. Some how it does set ones mind into inquiry mode.<BR>Just a thought.....<P>

<P>: While all eyes are on the debris field , and the railroad sleeper, there is something else quite strange in the lower right-hand corner , in the foreground, of Kents original picture. Looks to me like a neatly laid out step made of bricks. There Is also a chain and what could be the rear of a sign. Exactly where were these pictures taken? At a quick glance I would propose the rear of a shack in the desert. Just a thought….<BR>

<P>: There is more débris as well - toward the crater.<P>Good eyes, enhanced:<P><div class="centerimage" style="text-align:center"><img src="http://cyberspaceorbit.com/site_B115_det.jpg" /></div>

<P>:<BR>: <A HREF="http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/press/opportunity/20040524a/site_B115_navcam_180_cyl_L-B118R1_br2.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/press/opportunity/20040524a/site_B115_navcam_180_cyl_L-B118R1_br2.jpg</A><P>There is more débris as well - toward the crater.<P><div class="centerimage" style="text-align:center"><img src="http://www.surfingtheapocalypse.net/pix/pic39299.jpg" /></div>

<P><A HREF="http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/press/opportunity/20040524a/site_B115_navcam_180_cyl_L-B118R1_br2.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/press/opportunity/20040524a/site_B115_navcam_180_cyl_L-B118R1_br2.jpg</A><P><div class="centerimage" style="text-align:center"><img src="http://cyberspaceorbit.com/site_B115_navcamxx.jpg" /></div><div class="centerlink" style="text-align:center"><a href="http://cyberspaceorbit.com">http://cyberspaceorbit.com</a></div>